Comments on: Raising a vegan kid: the first 2 1/2 years http://www.vegblog.org/archive/2009/04/03/raising-a-vegan-kid-the-first-2-12-years/ I don’t eat sprouts (but I probably should). Mon, 15 Mar 2010 02:49:17 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9 hourly 1 By: TomOfMaine http://www.vegblog.org/archive/2009/04/03/raising-a-vegan-kid-the-first-2-12-years/comment-page-2/#comment-12793 TomOfMaine Thu, 19 Nov 2009 17:07:02 +0000 http://www.vegblog.org/?p=1382#comment-12793 Great story, thank you for sharing. Our son, vegan since conception, is almost 19 months old and loves plain, uncooked tofu dipped in nutritional yeast ! Great story, thank you for sharing. Our son, vegan since conception, is almost 19 months old and loves plain, uncooked tofu dipped in nutritional yeast !

]]> By: Laura http://www.vegblog.org/archive/2009/04/03/raising-a-vegan-kid-the-first-2-12-years/comment-page-2/#comment-12651 Laura Tue, 10 Nov 2009 12:01:02 +0000 http://www.vegblog.org/?p=1382#comment-12651 Dear god, I love your kid to pieces. ^_^ If I ever have children I'm going to raise them veggie myself. Dear god, I love your kid to pieces. ^_^ If I ever have children I’m going to raise them veggie myself.

]]> By: Elisa Rodriguez http://www.vegblog.org/archive/2009/04/03/raising-a-vegan-kid-the-first-2-12-years/comment-page-2/#comment-11853 Elisa Rodriguez Wed, 13 May 2009 01:47:30 +0000 http://www.vegblog.org/?p=1382#comment-11853 Jeremy is my husband. I decided to take over for him because once he starts he won't finish until he wins the debate. He read it as, provide adequate food consisting of all the aforementioned items in the definition. I kept telling him to shut up so I took it into my own hands. Jeremy is my husband. I decided to take over for him because once he starts he won’t finish until he wins the debate. He read it as, provide adequate food consisting of all the aforementioned items in the definition. I kept telling him to shut up so I took it into my own hands.

]]> By: Ryan http://www.vegblog.org/archive/2009/04/03/raising-a-vegan-kid-the-first-2-12-years/comment-page-2/#comment-11852 Ryan Wed, 13 May 2009 01:32:58 +0000 http://www.vegblog.org/?p=1382#comment-11852 Elisa/Jeremy (since you're from the same IP address I'm assuming you're together) -- I agree with Kelly... I see nothing there that indicates meat is required by law and that a child could be taken away for failing to give them meat. It doesn't specify "all of the following" and if they meant it, they would have been much more explicit. It is legalese, after all. So there you go. And I think this part of the disucssion has also gone about as far as it can go. Elisa/Jeremy (since you’re from the same IP address I’m assuming you’re together) — I agree with Kelly… I see nothing there that indicates meat is required by law and that a child could be taken away for failing to give them meat. It doesn’t specify “all of the following” and if they meant it, they would have been much more explicit. It is legalese, after all.

So there you go. And I think this part of the disucssion has also gone about as far as it can go.

]]> By: Elisa Rodriguez http://www.vegblog.org/archive/2009/04/03/raising-a-vegan-kid-the-first-2-12-years/comment-page-1/#comment-11851 Elisa Rodriguez Wed, 13 May 2009 01:01:53 +0000 http://www.vegblog.org/?p=1382#comment-11851 True. Our government violates our rights as often as possible. Did you know that property tax is against our constitutional rights. True. Our government violates our rights as often as possible. Did you know that property tax is against our constitutional rights.

]]> By: kelly g. http://www.vegblog.org/archive/2009/04/03/raising-a-vegan-kid-the-first-2-12-years/comment-page-1/#comment-11850 kelly g. Wed, 13 May 2009 00:52:18 +0000 http://www.vegblog.org/?p=1382#comment-11850 I'm no lawyer, but it seems to me that the phrase "consisting of but not limited to" leaves this portion of the (NJ?) statute up for interpretation. The "meats, grains, fruits, vegetables, dairy/dairy supplements, and fatty foods" bit sounds like an attempt to define what "food" is, rather than a requirement that parents feed their children all of the following. If one can feed a child "nutritional meals" that don't include meat, does this still count as "inadequate food"? Not to mention, a law mandating that parents absolutely must feed their children meat would violate the constitutional rights of parents whose religious beliefs preclude them from eating meat, particularly when there are perfectly healthy plant-based options available. I’m no lawyer, but it seems to me that the phrase “consisting of but not limited to” leaves this portion of the (NJ?) statute up for interpretation. The “meats, grains, fruits, vegetables, dairy/dairy supplements, and fatty foods” bit sounds like an attempt to define what “food” is, rather than a requirement that parents feed their children all of the following. If one can feed a child “nutritional meals” that don’t include meat, does this still count as “inadequate food”?

Not to mention, a law mandating that parents absolutely must feed their children meat would violate the constitutional rights of parents whose religious beliefs preclude them from eating meat, particularly when there are perfectly healthy plant-based options available.

]]> By: Elisa Rodriguez http://www.vegblog.org/archive/2009/04/03/raising-a-vegan-kid-the-first-2-12-years/comment-page-1/#comment-11849 Elisa Rodriguez Wed, 13 May 2009 00:12:44 +0000 http://www.vegblog.org/?p=1382#comment-11849 2C:24-4 Endangering Welfare of Children. a. Any person having a legal duty for the care of a child or who has assumed responsibility for the care of a child who: 1) engages in sexual conduct with the child, or 2) neglects the child by failing to take action to provide adequate food(1), clothing(2), shelter(3), medical care(4), or supervision to a child and thereby recklessly risking harm to the child, or 3) [alternative 1 N. Marianas] abuses the child by inflicting physical pain, injury, or mental distress upon the child, such pain or injury being clearly beyond the scope of reasonable corporal punishment, with the result that child's physical or mental health and well-being are harmed or threatened. 3) [alternative 2 NY] abuses the child by Inflicting or allowing to be inflicted physical injury by other than accidental means that causes or creates a substantial risk of death, serious or protracted disfigurement, protracted impairment of physical or emotional health, or protracted loss or impairment of the function of any bodily organ 3) [alternative 3 18 USC 2340 Torture] abuses the child by intentionally inflicting severe physical or mental pain on the child 3) [alternative 4 Geneva Convention; Additional Protocol of 1977] abuses the child by any intentional act or omission that seriously endangers the physical or mental health of the child 2C:24-4 Definitions (1) Nutritional meals consisting of but not limited to: meats, grains, fruits, vegetables, dairy/dairy supplements, and fatty foods (2) Consisting of but not limited to: clothing that covers at least 65 percent of the body (3) Residence consisting of four walls and a roof, able to withstand but not limited to: wind, rain, hail, and snow (4) Medical care consisting of but not limited to: hospitalization, sutures, ointments, prescribed medications, splints, and mental evaluations 2C:24-4 Endangering Welfare of Children.
a. Any person having a legal duty for the care of a child or who has assumed responsibility for the care of a child who:
1) engages in sexual conduct with the child, or
2) neglects the child by failing to take action to provide adequate food(1), clothing(2), shelter(3), medical care(4), or supervision to a child and thereby recklessly risking harm to the child, or
3) [alternative 1 N. Marianas] abuses the child by inflicting physical pain, injury, or mental distress upon the child, such pain or injury being clearly beyond the scope of reasonable corporal punishment, with the result that child’s physical or mental health and well-being are harmed or threatened.
3) [alternative 2 NY] abuses the child by Inflicting or allowing to be inflicted physical injury by other than accidental means that causes or creates a substantial risk of death, serious or protracted disfigurement, protracted impairment of physical or emotional health, or protracted loss or impairment of the function of any bodily organ
3) [alternative 3 18 USC 2340 Torture] abuses the child by intentionally inflicting severe physical or mental pain on the child
3) [alternative 4 Geneva Convention; Additional Protocol of 1977] abuses the child by any intentional act or omission that seriously endangers the physical or mental health of the child

2C:24-4 Definitions
(1) Nutritional meals consisting of but not limited to: meats, grains, fruits, vegetables, dairy/dairy supplements, and fatty foods
(2) Consisting of but not limited to: clothing that covers at least 65 percent of the body
(3) Residence consisting of four walls and a roof, able to withstand but not limited to: wind, rain, hail, and snow
(4) Medical care consisting of but not limited to: hospitalization, sutures, ointments, prescribed medications, splints, and mental evaluations

]]> By: kelly g. http://www.vegblog.org/archive/2009/04/03/raising-a-vegan-kid-the-first-2-12-years/comment-page-1/#comment-11848 kelly g. Tue, 12 May 2009 22:59:17 +0000 http://www.vegblog.org/?p=1382#comment-11848 "They aren’t, but they know the laws that say you can’t withhold meat from a developing child…" Statutes, please? “They aren’t, but they know the laws that say you can’t withhold meat from a developing child…”

Statutes, please?

]]> By: Jeremy http://www.vegblog.org/archive/2009/04/03/raising-a-vegan-kid-the-first-2-12-years/comment-page-1/#comment-11847 Jeremy Tue, 12 May 2009 21:50:54 +0000 http://www.vegblog.org/?p=1382#comment-11847 Let me correct post 33... "Raising your child as a vegan is considered by many(not me) to be neglect, and you can go to prison for endangering the welfare of a child, IF some anti-vegan were to complain to the authorities..." Let me correct post 33… “Raising your child as a vegan is considered by many(not me) to be neglect, and you can go to prison for endangering the welfare of a child, IF some anti-vegan were to complain to the authorities…”

]]> By: Jeremy http://www.vegblog.org/archive/2009/04/03/raising-a-vegan-kid-the-first-2-12-years/comment-page-1/#comment-11846 Jeremy Tue, 12 May 2009 21:45:42 +0000 http://www.vegblog.org/?p=1382#comment-11846 I didn't say that you WILL BE, I said that you COULD BE... I'm just telling you to be cautious of those who are flat out against it, because they usually tell others that your child has some form of nutritional deficiency, which in turn ends up on the desk of a case worker... I said that I'm behind them with their decision of how they choose to raise their children because no matter how potentially good or bad their diet is, the parents have good intentions in their heart... I have now learned that choline comes from soy and wheat, so I thank you for teaching me something that I didn't know... As for the "version of story", it could very well have been modified, but all I did was copy and paste from an old article out of an archive... I didn’t say that you WILL BE, I said that you COULD BE… I’m just telling you to be cautious of those who are flat out against it, because they usually tell others that your child has some form of nutritional deficiency, which in turn ends up on the desk of a case worker… I said that I’m behind them with their decision of how they choose to raise their children because no matter how potentially good or bad their diet is, the parents have good intentions in their heart… I have now learned that choline comes from soy and wheat, so I thank you for teaching me something that I didn’t know… As for the “version of story”, it could very well have been modified, but all I did was copy and paste from an old article out of an archive…

]]> By: ryan http://www.vegblog.org/archive/2009/04/03/raising-a-vegan-kid-the-first-2-12-years/comment-page-1/#comment-11845 ryan Tue, 12 May 2009 21:30:27 +0000 http://www.vegblog.org/?p=1382#comment-11845 1. I don't know where you got that version of the story, but it's from Scotland, <a href="http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/scotland/article4087977.ece" rel="nofollow">not New York</a>. The version you posted has been oddly modified. Anyway. Barbara Fisher <a href="http://www.tigersandstrawberries.com/2008/06/11/vegan-parenting-under-fire-again/" rel="nofollow">said it well</a>: "[J]ust because some vegan parents are ignorant, lazy, misinformed, careless, neglectful or abusive, that does not mean that all vegan parents are like them!" And, more importantly, it's not the veganism that's at fault, it's the parenting. 2. "The foods richest in phosphatidylcholine — the major delivery form of choline — are egg yolks, <strong>soy</strong>, <strong>wheat germ</strong> and cooked beef, chicken, veal and turkey livers. In 2004, the USDA released its first database of the choline content in common foods. The most often available choline dietary supplement is lecithin, <strong>derived from soy</strong> or egg yolks, often used as a food additive." 3. Re: the couple that deprived their six-week-old baby: the fact they were vegan has no bearing on that story. They're idiots. They fed their baby apple juice and soy milk instead of breastfeeding. You could have fed the child apple juice and cow's milk and the story would have had the same tragic ending. 4. "However you decide to raise your daughter, just remember that I'm behind you..." Wait... what? First I'm going to be arrested for raising my daughter vegan and now you're behind me? I'm confused. 1. I don’t know where you got that version of the story, but it’s from Scotland, not New York. The version you posted has been oddly modified.

Anyway. Barbara Fisher said it well: “[J]ust because some vegan parents are ignorant, lazy, misinformed, careless, neglectful or abusive, that does not mean that all vegan parents are like them!” And, more importantly, it’s not the veganism that’s at fault, it’s the parenting.

2. “The foods richest in phosphatidylcholine — the major delivery form of choline — are egg yolks, soy, wheat germ and cooked beef, chicken, veal and turkey livers. In 2004, the USDA released its first database of the choline content in common foods. The most often available choline dietary supplement is lecithin, derived from soy or egg yolks, often used as a food additive.”

3. Re: the couple that deprived their six-week-old baby: the fact they were vegan has no bearing on that story. They’re idiots. They fed their baby apple juice and soy milk instead of breastfeeding. You could have fed the child apple juice and cow’s milk and the story would have had the same tragic ending.

4. “However you decide to raise your daughter, just remember that I’m behind you…”

Wait… what? First I’m going to be arrested for raising my daughter vegan and now you’re behind me?

I’m confused.

]]> By: Jeremy http://www.vegblog.org/archive/2009/04/03/raising-a-vegan-kid-the-first-2-12-years/comment-page-1/#comment-11844 Jeremy Tue, 12 May 2009 21:19:45 +0000 http://www.vegblog.org/?p=1382#comment-11844 Cute by the way... Cute by the way…

]]> By: Jeremy http://www.vegblog.org/archive/2009/04/03/raising-a-vegan-kid-the-first-2-12-years/comment-page-1/#comment-11843 Jeremy Tue, 12 May 2009 21:19:23 +0000 http://www.vegblog.org/?p=1382#comment-11843 However you decide to raise your daughter, just remember that I'm behind you... I guess I read "Dietetic" wrong... However you decide to raise your daughter, just remember that I’m behind you… I guess I read “Dietetic” wrong…

]]> By: COD http://www.vegblog.org/archive/2009/04/03/raising-a-vegan-kid-the-first-2-12-years/comment-page-1/#comment-11842 COD Tue, 12 May 2009 21:08:35 +0000 http://www.vegblog.org/?p=1382#comment-11842 How cute, Ryan has a troll :) At least he didn't suggest you call the American Cattleman's Association for dietary advice. How cute, Ryan has a troll :) At least he didn’t suggest you call the American Cattleman’s Association for dietary advice.

]]> By: Jeremy http://www.vegblog.org/archive/2009/04/03/raising-a-vegan-kid-the-first-2-12-years/comment-page-1/#comment-11841 Jeremy Tue, 12 May 2009 21:08:01 +0000 http://www.vegblog.org/?p=1382#comment-11841 They aren't, but they know the laws that say you can't withhold meat from a developing child... They aren’t, but they know the laws that say you can’t withhold meat from a developing child…

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